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Grivenger
Many people
automatically assume that more HP is better. Actually, on the contrary, having
Break HP Limit is more a hindrance than anything. Staying with 9999HP is the
smartest option, although you can try using it if you want. After you do, try
not raising it. See how much easier it is not to raise it.

A big, big, big thanks to my good friend Theoden for compiling this list about
why Break HP Limit is redundant, and what attacks can do over 9999 damage at
max stats.

BASICS
========================================
• You can't heal more than 9999HP to everyone at once, except with Rikku's
Overdrive. Items are capped at 9999. Trio of 9999 and Pray will fully heal a
party that doesn't use BHPL.

• Stoic/Comrade will give slower Overdrive gain with higher max HP.

• Proportional damage attacks (e.g. Hydraulic Press, Demi, Mega Graviton, Fangs
of Chaos, etc) will do more damage with higher max HP. With 9999 HP, you can
fully heal in one shot. A BHPL character would have to waste more turns
healing.

• Celestial Weapons for four of the characters will be weakened if they don't
keep HP topped up.

• You never need BHPL. There are no attacks in the game that hit the whole
party for more than 9999 damage that cannot be predicted, blocked, reduced
below 9999 with Defensive measures or avoided altogether. Auto-Phoenix takes
care of attacks that hit a single character.

• Break HP Limit is useless if you haven't activated enough nodes to go over
9999 HP yet. Auto-Phoenix is useful throughout the whole game. Having two
characters with Auto-Phoenix in the active party makes you almost invincible
against attacks that hit just one character, no matter how powerful.

• Auto-Phoenix restores 9999HP max, so BHPL characters revived by it will be
near . Using Full Life to revive means wasting more turns, for both the
KO'ed character, and the character casting Full Life.

• BHPL won't make any difference if you get hit for 99,999 damage or instant
. Auto-Phoenix will. Powerful attacks will hit low Defence for 99,999
damage, so you need to raise Defence/Magic Def for BHPL to be useful. But if
you do raise them, you won't need BHPL, and they are easier to raise than HP.
Tanket and One Eye can be killed more easily and quickly than Ironclad.

• Getting Break HP Limit is tedious and time consuming.

• Collecting HP spheres from Ironclad is tedious and time consuming.

• Auto-Potion is good for maintaining full HP in some tough battles, but if you
have BHPL, it'll only keep you just above 50% HP.

ATTACKS THAT PENETRATE 9999HP
========================================
Just to make things seems a little clearer, here's a nice little list showing
you what attacks will penetrate 9999 HP, even with max Defence or Magic
Defence. Use the legend at the bottom to understand what the number's beside
each attack mean.

• Karma used by Tonberries (1,~3,5)
• 10,000 Needles used by Cactuars and Cactuar King (1,5)
• 99,999 Needles used by Cactuar King (1,3,5)
• Regurgitate used by Geosgaeono, only used if character kills him while
swallowed. (5)
• Zanmato used by Yojimbo/Dark Yojimbo (2,3,5)
• Convergence used by Th'uban (1,2,~3,5)
• Ethereal Cannon used by Nemesis (1,4)
• Ultra Spark used by Nemesis. The one attack that requires Auto-Life. Although
technically not predictable, (2) applies, since you can kill him before he
gets 8 turns.
• Armageddon used by Nemesis (3,5)
• Energy Blast used by Dark Valefor (2,5) *
• Meteor Strike used by Dark Ifrit (1,2,5) *
• Hellfire used by Dark Ifrit (2,5) *
• Thor's Hammer used by Dark Ixion (2,5) *
• Diamond Dust used by Dark Shiva (2,5) *
• Mega Flare used by Dark Bahamut (2) *
• Wakizashi used by Dark Yojimbo (4) *
• Oblivion used by Dark Anima (2) *
• Delta Attack used by the Dark Magus Sisters (2,3,5) *
• Camisade used by Dark Cindy (1) *
• Passado used by Dark Mindy - requires proof even with BHPL (1) *
• Razzia used by Dark Sandy (1) *
• Obliteration used by Penance (4) *
• Immolation used by Penance (1,4) *
• Judgement Day used by Penance (2,3,5) *

1: Hits only one character, so Auto-Phoenix can take care of it.
2: Attack used predictably, so can be blocked with an aeon.
3: Does 99,999 damage, so BHPL makes no difference.
4: Can be reduced below 9999 with additional support (e.g. Defence/Magic Def
+20%, Cheer, Focus, Shell, or Sentinel).
5: Preventable (enemy can be killed before using it, or conditions for attack
can be avoided).
*: PAL/International version exclusive.

========================================

With this strategy it will take LESS than 45 min to defeat Penance.

From: Theoden | Posted: 4/26/2005 10:24:56 AM | Message Detail
Recommended stats: 9999 HP, 255 Defence, 255 Strength, 170+ Agility, 85+ Luck (ideally 110), other stats don't matter

Equip
Auto-Haste (80 Chocobo Wings, bribe Machea)
Auto-Protect (70 Light Curtains, overkill Fafnir)
Defence +20% (4 Blessed Gems, overkill Cactuar King, rare steal from One Eye or Barbatos)
Auto-Potion (4 Stamina Tablets, get 60 for unlocking One Eye, rare steal from Adamantoise).

Auto-Potion will heal 9999 every time if either:
- You sell all Potions and Hi-Potions and Bribe Valaha for X-Potions (174K gil for 60)
or
- You use regular Potions and Mix Trio of 9999

Start by killing off the Arms as quickly as possible. You can ignore Obliteration, Auto-Potion keeps you at full HP.

When the Arms return attack them until you can kill them in one more turn. Only finish them if
- It's about to get a turn
or
- Penance is about to get a turn during the 2nd phase of battle while both arms are present. It's actually worth killing the Arm that reappears first as quickly as possible the first time it reappears only. From then on, always kill them at the last possible moment. This ensures both Arms won't reappear close together just before Penance's turn, and ensures you don't waste time killing them more often than you need to (kill an Arm early and it simply reappears sooner).

During the first phase of battle, throw a Three Stars to remove the need for MP. Also use Cheer 4 times (or Mix Ultra NulAll) to reduce Immolation damage below 9999.

When Penance's lower half breaks off, throw a Purifying Salt to remove his Haste status.

In the 2nd phase, Auto-Potion will heal Immolation damage. You need to cast Dispel on anyone hit by it to remove Armour Break (otherwise the next one will do 99,999 damage).

Attack Reels, Aurochs Reels, Blitz Ace, Slice & Dice and Tornado can be useful. I usually have Rikku Mix Eccentrick twice so Wakka, Tidus and Auron are affected. With Cheer x 4 (not 5) every Immolation will fully refill 2 characters' overdrives.

Using Overdrives can be better than Quick Hits. Compare time taken with damage:
Quick Hit (3 ticks) - 99,999 damage
Slice & Dice (6 ticks) - 6 hits, ~60K per arm hit, ~25K per body hit
Attack Reels (6 ticks) - 12 hits, ~50K per arm hit, ~20K per body hit
Aurochs Reels (6 ticks) - 3 x 99,999 if used while both arms are up
Blitz Ace (10 ticks) - 8 x ~28K + 99,999 on arm, not worth using on body
Tornado (10 ticks) - 2 x 99,999 to each arm and 2 x ~75K to body

ALL CREDITS GO TO THEODEN AND PJTIERNEY2003
Skynart
True, true and...TRUE!

Your post is defenitely true!
That΄s right, having 9999 is much better than having 99.999HP!
Hope everyone agrees, ΄cause it΄s absolutely right!
N2Y
Well, what you say is true, but for Dark Aeons it isn't.

Dark Aeons are able to be battle with in the PAL/International version. So not the USA version.


Dark Aeons do around 9999 damage every hit if it isn't more. Their Limit Break does 80,000+ damage, so you're not safe at all without HP Limit Break...
Grivenger
QUOTE
Dark Aeons do around 9999 damage every hit if it isn't more. Their Limit Break does 80,000+ damage, so you're not safe at all without HP Limit Break...


Auto-phoenix...
Ultraga
U got a point there Knighty Ho erm simply put its all depends on characters stats because I noticed when I first battled dark Valafor the aeon did 9999 damage all the time but once the my chracters had maxed out stats except luck of couse the damage was well Pathetic !!! ehhehehehehe

Ah wait am I rite ??? unsure.gif
N2Y
QUOTE (SupremeKnight @ Nov 13 2004, 10:17 PM)
QUOTE
Dark Aeons do around 9999 damage every hit if it isn't more. Their Limit Break does 80,000+ damage, so you're not safe at all without HP Limit Break...


Auto-phoenix...

Auto-Phoenix works one time, and your auto-phoenix caster cant hold on that long casting it, so eventually youll die before you beat the aeon.


as for max stats, luck is the most importnat laugh.gif , but defense isnt necessary, cuz Valefor does 9999 damage anyways, with or wihtout max defense
Grivenger
QUOTE
Auto-Phoenix works one time, and your auto-phoenix caster cant hold on that long casting it, so eventually youll die before you beat the aeon.


I didn`t understood very well what you said.

Auto-phoenix makes it so that when one character dies, the other (The one with the ability) throws a phoenix down to him. That lasts the whole battle as long as you have phoenix downs.
Seeing as you don`t need to waste 5-8 turns healing your characters because of BHPL, you can use these turns to cause damage to the enemy, being able to beat him way before you waste 99 phoenix downs (You probably don`t even waste 10-70).
If you have this ability equipped on at least two characters in your party, your team becomes almost invincible, regardless you have bhpl or not.
IMO, this is the best ability of the game, along with auto-haste.

Auto-life in FF9 only works one time per battle, but works even if all your characters are dead.

QUOTE
U got a point there Knighty Ho erm simply put its all depends on characters stats


Very true. For exemple, with 255 def, def+20% and one cheer, you can make exactly one attack of Penance (Doesn`t remember what), that affects all the party members dealing exactly less than 9999 damage.
Bishop Steven
I always thought Break HP Limit was a good thing, considering almost my whole party has it (got em from beating Nemsis many times). Yuna has the most in my party, near 30,000HP
Who actually uses Break MP Limit here? I do, but only Rikku has it. She has over 2000MP! i know you're all gonna say "use Half or One MP cost" but at the time, i didn't have enough items to make it so i figured, "why not use Break MP Limit?"
Grivenger
Break Mp ability is one of the worst abilities in the game, along with HP/MP Stroll, IMO. Unlike bhpl, this ability is REALLY useless. You don`t even need the one mp cost or half mp cost. Rare are the abilities that cost a lot (Full Break, which is useless against almost the strongest bosses, or Double-cast Ultima, which Yuna or Lulu can take care of with their celestial weapons).
If you ever need more mp, you can simply throw a turbo ether or cast osmose.
You will need the nods in the sphere grid to max all stats (Mainly for luck). Trying to have more mp can screw other far more important stats, mainly on the expert sphere grid.
A waste of slot, IMO.

I never had problems with mp. Just make sure you have 999.
Wasif Asif
Dunno Im just used to having BHPL so umm....ahhh...???....HEESH why the hell did you have to go and make that massive list of bad things about BHPL, ur making me feel as if I wasted my time trying to get it!!. Your comments are true but auto-phoenix and other abilities won't last forever...so sooner or later you may need 99,999 tongue.gif . If your list is 100% correct (which I sorta doubt tongue.gif ) , then tell me how can I beat Penance with 9999. The only convience I see is the fact you don't have to worry about mega-gravitation and healing, but I'm sure you've noticed even if you power up a great deal againts a guy like Penance it's kinda futile because I HIGHLY doubt he's gonna sit idoly by and let you power up your status. Even with maxed out stats 9999 won't take you to far againts an enemy like Penance dry.gif .
Grivenger
That`s when aeons and auto-life comes.

QUOTE
• Obliteration used by Penance (4) *
• Immolation used by Penance (1,4) *
• Judgement Day used by Penance (2,3,5) *

1: Hits only one character, so Auto-Phoenix can take care of it.
2: Attack used predictably, so can be blocked with an aeon.
3: Does 99,999 damage, so BHPL makes no difference.
4: Can be reduced below 9999 with additional support (e.g. Defence/Magic Def
+20%, Cheer, Focus, Shell, or Sentinel).
5: Preventable (enemy can be killed before using it, or conditions for attack
can be avoided).

---

QUOTE
Dunno Im just used to having BHPL so umm....ahhh...???....HEESH why the hell did you have to go and make that massive list of bad things about BHPL, ur making me feel as if I wasted my time trying to get it!!.


Don`t be sad. BHPL isn`t useless, just not needed. There are better ways to battle these sub-bosses, without wasting a lot of time and making the battles very annoying, true, but if you already got it, not that it is actually a bad thing wink.gif
As long as you don`t care wasting turns healing an healing, just play the game like nothing happened wink.gif .

---

You can also use some of the things in my first post to help you to make the battles easier, EVEN with bhpl armor.
Higher your knowledge about the enemy, easier the battle. It is a RPG (At least FF) rule wink.gif
Wasif Asif
QUOTE (SupremeKnight @ Nov 14 2004, 11:43 PM)
That`s when aeons and auto-life comes.

QUOTE
• Obliteration used by Penance (4) *
• Immolation used by Penance (1,4) *
• Judgement Day used by Penance (2,3,5) *

1: Hits only one character, so Auto-Phoenix can take care of it.
2: Attack used predictably, so can be blocked with an aeon.
3: Does 99,999 damage, so BHPL makes no difference.
4: Can be reduced below 9999 with additional support (e.g. Defence/Magic Def
+20%, Cheer, Focus, Shell, or Sentinel).
5: Preventable (enemy can be killed before using it, or conditions for attack
can be avoided).

---

QUOTE
Dunno Im just used to having BHPL so umm....ahhh...???....HEESH why the hell did you have to go and make that massive list of bad things about BHPL, ur making me feel as if I wasted my time trying to get it!!.


Don`t be sad. BHPL isn`t useless, just not needed. There are better ways to battle these sub-bosses, without wasting a lot of time and making the battles very annoying, true, but if you already got it, not that it is actually a bad thing wink.gif
As long as you don`t care wasting turns healing an healing, just play the game like nothing happened wink.gif .

---

You can also use some of the things in my first post to help you to make the battles easier, EVEN with bhpl armor.
Higher your knowledge about the enemy, easier the battle. It is a RPG (At least FF) rule wink.gif

Well....(Damn I gotta say it dry.gif ) Thanks for the info.... smile.gif
Grivenger
This topic is old, but better than creating a new one.

I've edited my first post. It now shows a strategy of how to beat Penance without BHPL. Credits to Theoden from GF, again.
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